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 Post subject: Weight Savings of S-33
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 4:59 pm 
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Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2005 4:48 pm
Posts: 41
Location: Eugene Oregon
This question probably should go on the Waterford site since I assume that using the S-33 tubing is not a Gunnar option, but my question is what is the weight savings in a 61cm Sport/Roadie or similar design in using s33 tubing versus the OSII?

I absolutely LOVE my OSII Sport and ride it alot. But in visiting the Waterford forum, it seems that there are alot of very happy owners of S33 bikes.

Thanks

Pat Mc


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:02 am 
Howdy,

You are correct that the S3 is a Waterford tube set. Typical weight savings are in the 1/2 pound area.

The cool thing is that the OS2 gives about 85% of the performance of the S3.


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 Post subject: S33 tubing
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:56 am 
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Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2005 4:48 pm
Posts: 41
Location: Eugene Oregon
Dave

Actually I was pleased to read your reply....so was my savings account. At a half pound I think I will continue to put miles on my Sport. The Sport is such a versatile bike. I just put on my fenders, and lights for fall commuting, while contemplating whether I will ride it for RAMROD (Ride Around Mt Ranier) which is a 154 mile one day ride with 10,000 ft of climbing next August. Certainly the bike can do it...now the rider that is another question.

Pat Mc


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 2:17 pm 
Hey Pat,

No "easy button" for that ride! Only 10 months to get your motor ready... :D


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 8:49 pm 
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Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2005 5:23 pm
Posts: 10
Location: Indianapolis, IN
What is meant by "the OS2 gives about 85% of the performance" [of the S3]? When you are refering to the 'performance' of a steel tube, what is meant? Do you mean it's 85% of the stiffness? It's 15% heavier? Please enlighten us, the unenlightened?

Was OS2 used in the 2003 CrossHairs? I presume that the Gunnar folks like OS2 better than the 853? It seems LeMond has also made the switch. Is this because it's an easier material to work with than 853? A better value? Sourcing is better? ie. if you would give us a quick comparo of S3 vs. OS2 vs. 853. Thanks!!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 12:22 pm 
Hello mistermo,

I have introduced Waterford co-owner and designer Marc Muller's comments into our conversation:

"The figure of “85%” is an illustrative comparison, not an empirical or analytical one. When we developed the O/S-2 and S-3 tubesets in conjunction with True Temper, rest assured each tube section, diameter, shape and wall thickness was thoroughly evaluated relative to the expected loads and to each other. To publish such numbers would compromise the proprietary nature of such research. After tubesets were built into prototype framesets and bicycles, our riders found the O/S-2 frames mimicked many of the desirable ride characteristics and feel of the S-3 framesets which we all agreed represent ed a new benchmark in ride quality. The O/S-2 tubes are easier to manufacture than the S-3 tubes and likewise can be built into frames with fewer of the specific production procedures required by the S-3 tubes. The net result is that the O/S-2 offers a very favorable price/performance ratio, which we called “85%”. "

OS2 is our proprietary name for the custom True Temper OX Platinum tubes we use. OS2 stands for; Oversized-Second Generation derived from the OS Paramounts Marc introduced in 1988. The OS philosophy has carried through to the current lugged Waterfords. When we added TIG frames as a Waterford option, our OS2 plans were realized for both Waterford and Gunnar.

We still use Reynolds 853 in our lugged Waterfords. True Temper has proven to be a willing partner in developing the potential of air-hardening steel alloys. You see that result in tubes like the S3 and OX Platinum. They are enabling us to shift the perception paradigm of 'steel'. The riders of the product can attest to that.

The 2003 Crosshairs was a mix of 853 and OX Plat. Late spring '04 they became OS2.

Hope that helps,


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2005 2:50 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2005 10:12 pm
Posts: 40
Location: Berlin, WI
Dave,

Following your chronology of the OS2/853 tubing mix am I correct in assuming that my Roadie frame purchased new in 10/03 was a mix of both 853/OS2...as the "all" OS2 began Spring 04? It's interesting to me as I've got a true temper hockey stick shaft...they're an industry leader there as well!

_________________
Kneel to the steel...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2005 10:15 am 
Howdy steel4me,

You would be correct. Marc is also a hockey nut/coach and uses True Temper sticks as well.


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